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Post by Dominion of Zabéara on Jan 23, 2014 18:18:19 GMT
Khizlek pointed something out to me recently. As many of you know, taking propulsion experts gives you access to engines that are absurdly fast (about triple the speed of regular engines, both in regular play and combat). This would make them a must-have, more or less.
However, Khizlek noticed that improved versions of the propulsion experts engine up the tech tree are actually much slower than those lvl 1 engines, and thus the huge bonus for those early engines is most likely a bug.
I'm inclined to agree, and as such think it would be prudent to ban taking propulsion experts. But of course everyone should get a chance to voice their opinion first.
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Post by The Kortl Rheus on Jan 23, 2014 18:38:52 GMT
Low end better than high end with no other disadvantages? Seems like a bug to me.
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Post by D'Kali Hegemony on Jan 23, 2014 18:56:18 GMT
Definitely sounds like a bug to be sure. I don't see why PvK would have jacked up the expert engines so much between this version and the last we played. I would assumer that the higher level versions of the engines are still faster than the standard (non-expert) versions?
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Post by Dominion of Zabéara on Jan 23, 2014 19:00:12 GMT
They seem marginally better than regular, definitely nothing like 300% better.
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Post by khizlek on Jan 23, 2014 19:17:26 GMT
With 'larger' (cruiser+) them seem to improve speed by 1 when compared to normal engines, which fits in with the difference between them and the other speed trait - it uses less characteristic traits, but costs more to build, uses up more tonnage/space in a design, and use more supply. I thought it'd probably be changed during the game, but I'm happy to ban Propulsion Experts as well, if everyone who has it is given a chance to rework their empires. EDIT: To give everyone an idea of the in game stats Type
| Normal
Engine
| High
Perform
| 'Economy'
high perform
| Ion
| 9
| 30
|
| | Contra | 11
| 12
|
| | Jacked | 13
| 14
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| | Quantum | 15
| 17
| 16
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Post by Dominion of Zabéara on Jan 23, 2014 19:19:50 GMT
With 'larger' (cruiser+) them seem to improve speed by 1 when compared to normal engines, which fits in with the difference between them and the other speed trait - it uses less characteristic traits, but costs more to build, uses up more tonnage/space in a design, and use more supply. I thought it'd probably be changed during the game, but I'm happy to ban Propulsion Experts as well, if everyone who has it is given a chance to rework their empires. We'll delay the game start to Friday to facilitate said fixing. Besides, I know if we wait until Friday we will add 1-3 new players. |
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Post by khizlek on Jan 23, 2014 19:31:56 GMT
Wait, is this to remove the trait, or fix the component file?
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Post by Dominion of Zabéara on Jan 23, 2014 19:41:26 GMT
To remove the trait from empires files. I'm not exactly sure how to go about fixing it. Which file would be edited?
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Post by Sethulkra Hive on Jan 23, 2014 20:17:36 GMT
we could just edit the component data file. I could easily do it, but we would all have to use the same files. I believe more variety is always good.
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Post by Dominion of Zabéara on Jan 23, 2014 20:20:40 GMT
we could just edit the component data file. I could easily do it, but we would all have to use the same files. I believe more variety is always good. If you want to edit the file and post it publicly for downloading, i'll happily add it to the posted list of things that must be done before a player can play. My only concern is that the list is already a bit tedious, considering many players are brand new to this already complex game, especially since I would like to get this game launched tomorrow at the latest and this would be one more minor hurtle to jump. On the other hand, one more downloadable file shouldn't be the straw to break the Camel's back in terms of deterring people to play... Edit: A good question may be, would anyone actually take propulsion experts if it were fixed? If we have at least one positive answer, then we have a solid reason to go through the extra hurtle to fix it. Otherwise, my preference is for an outright ban just for simplicity's sake. From the perspective of a new player this is all so much to take in already, and im not sure the extra effort will be worth the delay unless someone actually plans on taking the trait with the bug removed. Let that person speak, and we will hold things up to get this fixed as well... |
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Post by D'Kali Hegemony on Jan 23, 2014 20:23:07 GMT
That should be the Comonents.txt data file in the Proportions3.1.3 file. The problem is if we don't all edit the file perfectly, it would be very game breaking. If anyone is in contact with PvK, we could always ask for a quick patch, though then everyone would have to redownload the new version and remake their races for it.
We could always have a gentle men's agreement, ban ion high performance engines, allow the rest.
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Post by Dominion of Zabéara on Jan 23, 2014 20:35:19 GMT
That should be the Comonents.txt data file in the Proportions3.1.3 file. The problem is if we don't all edit the file perfectly, it would be very game breaking. If anyone is in contact with PvK, we could always ask for a quick patch, though then everyone would have to redownload the new version and remake their races for it. We could always have a gentle men's agreement, ban ion high performance engines, allow the rest. A gentlemen's agreement would be alright, I would find that preferable to all this stuff about yet more modding and file sharing and further game delaying. I still find an agreement just not to use it simpler, unless someone is really dedicated to taking them. |
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Post by Sethulkra Hive on Jan 23, 2014 22:18:29 GMT
I wont take the trait.
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Post by Dominion of Zabéara on Jan 23, 2014 22:34:36 GMT
Neither will I. Without the magic 30 space-a-turn engines, IMHO the 1,000 points are much better spent somewhere else, no matter what kind of race you're RP.
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Post by Imperial Hegemon on Jan 23, 2014 23:33:42 GMT
Yes... yes... I too, as a gentleman, will not take that trait...  Done and done! *quick, go grab that trait so we can rule the universe!* |
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